Analiza: Welcome to the Women of Color Rise podcast. I'm Analiza Quiroz Wolf, proud Filipino-American executive leadership coach and former CEO of a nonprofit and Captain in the U.S. Air Force. I'm also the author of The Myth of Success: A Woman of Color's Guide to Leadership. It's based on the lessons learned by many women of color leaders, including those on this podcast. We talk with successful CEOs and C-suite women leaders of color and learn about their leadership journeys. I'm on a mission to support having more diverse leaders at the table. If you're a woman or a woman of color who wants to sit at that table, you're in the right place. Now let's get into today's show.

Friends. I am thrilled to be talking with Aliya Abbas today. She has such a diverse background, everything from the financial industry, Prudential city group, to the media industry at Warner Brothers and also at Estee Lauder in beauty. She's now the Chief of Staff at the New Jersey Higher Education Student Assistance Authority, and I am so thrilled because Alia has this wide background. I can't wait to get into this conversation. Thanks for being here, Alia,

Alia: Thank you so much for having me.

Analiza: Alia, we always start this podcast with how you identify and how that identity shaped your career.

Alia: So I identify as a Muslim, Middle Eastern woman, as you could see, I was really influenced by my parents, immigrant my well upbringing as a with by my immigrant parents, and they valued hard work and education, and then I think on another aspect, my abilities or my disability, I always knew that there was something going on. My father, God bless him, never told me that I had a disability. So he always pushed, you know, pushed my ambitions. There were no limitations. It was just hard work to get through it to find out when I was in my undergrad that I was diagnosed with a visual impairment, but at that point, my mindset was already done and you know, handling challenges was no big deal.

Analiza: Alia, when we talk about your appearance, because we not everyone's going to be watching on YouTube. Can you talk about what that means and how you would know that you are Middle Eastern women.

Alia: So even though I went to Catholic school, put that aside, I am a walking billboard for Islam. I wear a hijab, I wear modest clothing. I do not wear a burka. So that was one of the things my friends were always worried about when I told them I didn't always wear a hijab, and when I was starting to move towards that, my friends were worried about me just based on the climate that we were in, based on stereotypes. I'm going to be dressed all in black. And when people saw my LinkedIn picture, they were like, wow, you wore red. And I was like, Yes, we can wear color. I could be fashionable, right?

Analiza: Alia, hijab, the decision to wear that you hadn't always done through your professional life. What was there for a moment?

Alia: My sister wears the hijab, but I just wasn't ready for it, because it's a commitment, and I just jumped right in. It was, you know, the first Ramadan during COVID. I woke up on the first day of Ramadan and started wearing it and never took it off. I'm a believer that everything happens for a reason. People are put in your path for certain reasons. I would be stopped and be complimented on the way I'm appearing.

Analiza: Alia at the same time. I love that you get these compliments and this recognition that you can be beautiful and are worthy of attention because actually of what you choose to wear, and you had also mentioned stereotypes, I'm curious about that when it's not so beautiful, when it's not so complimentary, what has that been like for you? How have you been able to overcome that?

Alia: Yeah, I think the biggest stereotype is one, and we talked about it briefly, about dress right? Like, how do you appear? You're not going to appear corporate enough, you're not going to appear professional enough. You can't wear a Hijab and go to work. Well, technically, you can but because I've done it the first week of Ramadan, because I had to run out of work and go straight to the mosque, so I did, and I got complimented on those two people were really like, wow, that's really pretty, but it's also the stereotype that I'm educated, right, that I'm not married yet. They're like, well, aren't you married? That was actually one of the things. When I started wearing a hijab, I had people ask, did you get married? And I was like, No, it was something that I've decided, wow, shocking, that you're educated. I have three degrees, right? That maybe bachelor's was enough. But no, my parents really pushed on education. Continuous learning was a big, big thing in my family. So I think a lot of the timidness I am, far from timid. I am actually extremely loud. People always have to ask me to lower my voice. I own the room. I'm not a meek one. I'm at the table. I speak up at the table, and I don't let anyone male or female really bring me down.

Analiza: Alia, you'd also mentioned in addition to having a lot of confidence to wear the job and also name that you have a visual impairment, but have not let that stop you. Can you? Can you talk about that? Because it's, it's quite courageous. This is the theme I'm hearing about knowing who you are and being really confident standing for that. What has it been like for you in terms of the visual impairment, professionally, especially?

Alia: It's not obvious. People who look at me cannot tell I do not have the stereotype of a dog with me. I do use a cane, but it's predominantly at night, because I blind as a bat at night, right? So I'm visually impaired by day, but I'm blind as a bat at night. People don't really hold that against me or even notice it, but I think the hardest part is actually as I grew in my seniority versus when I was just starting out entry level, I have to Say I have been blessed though that most of the companies that I've worked with provided me the accessibility and the needs that I need to be able to do my job larger screens. I think the biggest part of it is people sometimes think you're flexible because I need a large monitor, right? I need certain things, lighting, for example. But it's far from the truth, because I'm living in a world that wasn't set up for me, right? I'm living in a world that I'm supposed to conform to certain things, right? Do you see that? Do you see the PowerPoint? I can't get to work back and forth easily without public transportation. So I think one of them is, you know, adaptability, and you know, depends on how you look at it. Yes, I'm not flexible when it comes to certain needs that I need, but I am flexible and adaptable when it comes to working, because it's the way it's been all my life. Now I gotta just find another way to make it work.

Analiza: Alia, what I hear you saying, especially not only do you use their clear courage through line, through your story, and owning and being proud of who you are. There's also a piece of this. The world is built. How it's built. I'm going to make it work. Ideally, I'd have these accommodations made, but I'm used to it. What do you wish people knew or could take into consideration? We are capable.

Alia: I think that is the biggest thing, because most people think you can't do something, right? So for me, it's hard work, and you work through it. I've had conversations with my parents. I've been asked to speak with parents who have children who are visually, visually impaired. And I constantly get questions on, how do you tell your child that he can't he or she can't do something? And it's like, why are you telling them that they can't do it? Right? You should have them try to do it. They can tell you if they can't do it or not. It takes you from point A to point B. It may take me from point A to point Z to point T to get back to B, but I'll eventually get to be right. And I try to use the example of you know going to work. You can drive, you can walk, you could take a bus, you could take a train, you could take a plane, you can there's so many ways of getting to your destination that it doesn't have to be in the same way that you are doing it. And at the same time, having somebody with a different ability, or just different in general, right? I like to build also diverse teams, where you put people together and they're like, it's the Island of Misfit Toys, and it's not because you have an older person, you have a person who's blind, you have a you have all these different type of people, but everybody comes with a different skill and a different talent, right? You could speak and be looking at a slide. I don't see the slide, but I picture it in a different way, and that way I see it in a different way. I can suggest something because the way I heard it, not the way I'm seeing it. I'm not influenced by the site. I'm influenced by the tone. I'm influenced by the words that you are saying,

Analiza: Alia, the themes of not assuming incompetence. In fact, we can assume competence. There's just different ways of getting there. And second, valuing the difference and saying, Wow, we're only going to be stronger because you have a different point of view. Thank you for seeing my presentation and actually in your head and based on my words, that's a view I would not get from other people. So I love that so much. Alia, with your career, I mean, you've done so many things, so many things, strategy, operations, innovation, finance. Can you say, Alia, can you point to, you know, here's one of my mindsets or leadership moves or views that have helped me have this career where you've been able to grow and also have grown an impact. What would you say that would be?

Alia: I think it's the mindset that is just the continuous learning mindset, that there's always something else to learn, and I think also it's confidence. For me, it's really about confidence, and that started as a kid. I realized at a young age that when you speak with authority, when you carry yourself well, people are willing to listen to you and follow you. And interestingly enough, that came up when I was young. We would go to Egypt every summer. And one year I was around eight or nine, and my dad and my uncle took us to Giza to see the pyramids, right? So, pyramids, you know, you see the tips of them as you're driving by. Want to go. So we went. So I was a walking encyclopedia for Ancient Egypt. I had a third grade teacher who missed Valenti, who I still speak to till this day, and she really supported my learning of my culture in Egypt. So every single book report was about something about Egypt. So we go to Egypt, and I'm walking an encyclopedia. I'm pointing to things, I'm explaining things to my dad. I'm in Arabic and in English, because my uncle only speaks Arabic, so I'm doing it in both. And after a while, you know, unbeknownst to me, but after a while, I noticed these tourists, American tourists, starting to like, follow us, and you know, they kept nodding when, you know, I was speaking, when I was pointing to something, they, you know, started taking pictures, and then I heard some guy whisper, like, this tour guide is really good. And then towards the end, like, we get to a point where this couple comes up to me and tries to give me money. My dad was dying of laughter. My uncle was laughing hysterically. And the guy just shrugs his hands, and he's like, You should work here, and he still gives me the money, and, like, walks away, right? So a couple of things. Learn that if you carry yourself and you know, you know, come. Confidence, right? Confidence is a part of it. Also my religion, my faith, also helps that, you know, it's Ramadan currently, right now, I'm fasting. The discipline around it, it grounds me. So you have to have something to, you know, ground yourself on that as well.

Analiza: Oh yeah, I love this, these stories, and I can picture you as a third grader giving this tour so good that Americans will want to tip you and pay you. Let's move to lightning round. Are you ready? Chocolate or vanilla?

Alia: Vanilla.

Analiza: Cooking or takeout.

Alia: Takeout.

Analiza: Climb a mountain or jump from a plane?

Alia: I've done both, so both.

Analiza: Have you ever worn socks with sandals?

Alia: So I'm Muslim. You have to wear socks with sandals when you go to Saudi Arabia to do pilgrimage. There's just no way around it, or your feet will get cut up.

Analiza: How would you rate your karaoke skills on a scale of one to ten, ten being Mariah Carey?

Alia: A negative 10, I can't read the lyrics. I make up my own words, and half the times the sentences don't make sense. It's whatever words match the tone of the song.

Analiza: What's a good book that you've read?

Alia: Seven Rules of Self-Reliance by Maha Abouelenein talks about how it's a really good self confidence, self assurance. Gives practical advice.

Analiza: What's a good professional development that you've done?

Alia: Coaching, I would say it provided me it's good to work with someone, provides you a framework, provides you insights and gives you some accountability.

Analiza: What advice would you give your younger self?

Alia: I would say, enjoy the journey a little bit more. I would say, you know, it's not a race, the journey isn't a race. And that stays true to your values, and you should be, stay true to your values. And then the last thing, which I still till this day, try to tell myself is focus on what I do, my actions and what I do and the effort, and not the outcome, because not necessarily the outcome is in my control.

Analiza 17:53 And then, where can we find you? LinkedIn, anywhere else,

Alia: Predominantly LinkedIn. I do not do most social media, and I'll tell you why, it's not easily accessible. So if they made these apps a bit more accessible, I'd be more inclined to use them. They'd be easier to use so

Analiza: And then last question, Alia, do you have a final ask recommendation or any parting thoughts to share?

Alia: I would say the final thought would be just looking at my career. I would say the best opportunities aren't always the ones that you plan for. They're the ones that you're willing to step into and do.

Analiza: Thank you so much, Alia, for your stories. It's so inspiring. I really appreciate you sharing.

Alia: Thank you so much. I really enjoyed our conversation. Looking forward to doing another one soon.

Analiza: Thank you so much for carving out time to hear today's podcast. 3 things before you go. First, if you found it helpful, please leave a five star review. Second, you can get a free chapter of my book, The Myth of Success: A Woman of Color's Guide to Leadership at analizawolf.com/freechapter. And lastly, if you're interested in executive coaching, please reach out to me at analiza@analizawolf.com. Thank you so very much.