Analiza:: Welcome to the Women of Color Rise podcast. I'm Analiza Quiroz Wolf, proud Filipino-American executive leadership coach and former CEO of a nonprofit and Captain in the U.S. Air Force. I'm also the author of The Myth of Success: A Woman of Color's Guide to Leadership. It's based on the lessons learned by many women of color leaders, including those on this podcast. We talk with successful CEOs and C-suite women leaders of color and learn about their leadership journeys. I'm on a mission to support having more diverse leaders at the table. If you're a woman or a woman of color who wants to sit at that table, you're in the right place. Now let's get into today's show.

Hi everyone. I am thrilled to be with Nella Garcia Urban today. She's the CEO of Denver School of Science and Technology, which is 16 schools in Denver and Aurora. She came. From Yes, prep public schools, and she spent over 20 years in various roles leading charter schools. Education-wise. She graduated from Rice University as a Mellon Mays fellow, and she has her master's degree from Sam Houston State University in Education Leadership. Nella. It's fantastic to finally get to connect. I've been a fan of yours for a long time.

Nella:: Thank you. I'm very excited. I followed you for so long and read everything you post on LinkedIn and then when I got to hear RA's podcast, I was so excited to listen to her story because we used to work together and have since gotten to listen to more of your podcasts and really support what you're doing, especially for mothers who are also leaders.And I'm thrilled. It is gonna be one of the best parts of my day.

Analiza:: So Nella, let's start. You mentioned being a mother. I also know you're the board chair of an organization that supports Latino educators. Talk about your identity.

Nella:: Yeah.

Analiza:: How do you identify and how has that shaped your career?Did you know you wanted to be a CEO?

Nella:: Yeah. First and foremost, I always identify as a Latina mother of two. And I also identify as a charter school leader. I'm a charter school zealot. I often say I believe so deeply in family choice. I am a C-E-O of a large charter management organization.But more than anything, like my identity is just grounded in being a Latina from Texas, who is also a mother, partner, daughter, granddaughter, and all of those identities really shape the way that I think about my work, the way that I think about how I show up the values that I lead with every single day. I didn't always know that I wanted to be a CEO of a charter school network, but I always did know that I wanted to be a leader in my family. There was a very strong conviction around leadership, around showing up being willing to take charge and for the betterment of others. It is very strong.Belief around community and supporting your community, and also this ideal around doing your best and working hard. And so I, that was really ingrained in me and so I always wanted to lead. I didn't really know that I, this was my goal until 2019 when I became part of the Broad Academy for superintendent preparation and.

A little light bulb went off. And I didn't really know it was possible until 2013 'cause I had not seen leaders that look like me. And then, that span of time I started to think about maybe there was a little seed planted. But the day that I set the goal was that first seminar abroad.

Analiza:: That's fantastic. Nella, I'm hearing this thread of you carrying, wanting to serve the leadership seed was planted early on, and yet it never dawned on you, maybe the CEO and that you would be ahead. Yeah. So I wanna juxtapose those ideas because yeah. It is beautiful to have this leader mindset like, I'm going to co and serve and you've had so many years of experience leading and serving.And yet I'm like, oh, I was surprised. You're like, and I didn't think about it until the light bulb moment went off. Can we talk about that?

Nella:: Yeah. I think that so much of the way that we think about leadership is about exposure and access. And I saw leadership in my family in lots of different ways. My grandmother, my dad, my mother, then you go and at school you have all these different opportunities. One of my greatest lessons in leadership came when I was senior class president and we had this situation where we were selling these plates and we just had way too many of them. And I will never forget that moment.Everyone's looking at me like what are we gonna do? And I was like, oh gosh., I need to figure out what to do. And something clicked in me. Hey, when you are the leader, you have to find solutions. Either think of them creatively yourself or source them from the people around you.And that was being a senior in high school and I always sought that leadership. But then you get into the work, your career, the work force, and there's often a lot of messages that make you question whether or not you are positioned for leadership. And I think one of the biggest is when you just don't see representation.And it's hard for them to associate and to build that connection. With a leader. When I was in college, I did an internship at the mayor's office.The woman that I was being mentored by was also a Rice alumna Latina woman, and I connected so deeply, like with her story, her identity, she taught me so many lessons.That was a very special opportunity that I had. And I, so I could see okay, this is a director in a big government office. Like it's possible somehow she got there, right? And so you start to associate your own TRA trajectory in that way. And when I started to see more representation, especially in the charter world, which.Has made a lot of strides in diversifying our leadership, but there were parts of that era where strong representation wasn't visible. Then I think you then start to dream bigger and better for yourself.

Analiza:: You're so speaking to my soul, and I feel like we care so much, and yet it does matter, right? It's like we don't put the two together, that could be us. We're only, at least for me, moving into the education world, I was so happy to serve. And yet I never saw anyone. I think I was the only person of color on the leadership team of a big, charter management organization that talked about DEI before it became a priority for so many of us.So I wanna talk about just diversity in so many ways, right? There's diversity in our race where we come from in terms of the country, our class, our gender, obviously sexuality. There's so many pieces. And there's also this piece of neurodivergence. Because we don't often talk about that, and I'd love for you to share what does that mean for you?

Nella:: For me personally, I learned that I struggled with my attention. Actually after college, I really wish that I would have learned in college because as soon as you're aware that you, there's something different about the way that your brain works and processes, then you can start to build skills to help.Help manage it and to also ask for what you need at the same time. And early on in my twenties, I started to recognize that I did have an attention deficit disorder and that I needed to find ways to better manage it. And then as I've gotten. Further in my career, I've started to understand how it's both an asset and also what I need from the people around me and from myself in order to feel successful and to not.Not struggle as much as you possibly could. And taking really good care of the way that my brain works is something really important to me. And the boundaries that I set for myself have mattered a lot. The way that I communicate with other people about how my brain works a little bit differently is also.It has also been really important and it's something that I talk about pretty openly because number one, a lot of our students also struggle with certain aspects of the way their brain works. It's also beautiful that neurodivergence is something that we should know about and understand about each other because we're a community and we have to help each other learn and grow together.But I talk about it openly because it also just is part of how I have to work. And I've learned that actually for somebody like me with a DHD, like the CEO role is actually a really great role because you go from thing to thing really quickly and you've gotta be able to shift your focus and you never get bored.And and there I actually sometimes say, sometimes people are like, I don't know how you do that. You go from this to this, that, and I'm like, I think actually my brain was designed for me to be in this role.

Analiza:: I wanna go there because yeah, sometimes we say, oh, neurodivergence, oh poor you, right? Oh no. What do we have to do to help you? Get over this hurdle. How terrible. And I love that you say it's an asset and you're even connecting it to Actually, I'm a better CEO because I transition really well and I'm good with variety and just completely, you go right into a room and you don't really have as a CEO the warmup, right?It's going right in. Completely new information, new people, new context, and then they're expecting you to respond. So yeah, let's talk about this as a strength, as an asset. I'd love for you to just go off on that idea because we can hear this.

Nella:: For me, the way that my ADHD presents itself is that lots of things can distract me.And so to someone else. I'll give you a good example. I've been in meetings before and we're in a place where there's a road in front of you and loud vehicles are moving, and for me, my brain has to start like all over again. But to someone else the noise doesn't make a difference at all. So sometimes I've just had to learn to let people know Hey, I'm gonna really struggle to stay focused because I'm hearing this. And I think that also just gives other people permission to share something that they need. For example, if. Lighting bothers you. It's okay to ask, Hey y'all, is it okay if we just open the blinds and turn this down?I think that when we come into the work world, we're always like, how do I fit in as quickly as possible? How do I not make waves? How do I not take up too much space? And we often don't actually ask for what they need. And to me, that's an asset to be able to say, there's actually something that I need.

What might other people need in order to show up as their best? I've also had the opportunity to share with people that I don't need a lot of context to help or to understand where the conversation is going. My brain works really quickly. I can go from thing to thing in a fast-paced way.It doesn't exhaust me. And that has also helped people understand that it's okay to bother me. A lot of times when you're in an executive level position, many folks assume that you're too busy to listen. And my hope is that I can really change that narrative. I can be present with you at the moment. I can only focus on you because if I focus on anything else, I won't.I won't be at my best. And in that way, I found it as an asset.

Analiza:: Wow, Nella. I hear that your ability to go deep quickly on complex content allows one nice CEO move, right? Because constantly that is the nature of the job. And then two people see, okay, Nella speaks what she needs. That means I can too. How often have we seen a woman of color saying, Hey, look. I need to actually close the door or the creek is bothering me, or all of the movement needs to change. It's so empowering, right? It's so empowering to see that. So I love that. No, it's just, I don't, I am someone who has been looking for women of color throughout my career too, here's a model for me.One, they're rare, but two, they're definitely like, it's like the fit in strategy. Let's fit in. Let's not make waves. Let's mimic in hopes that maybe then I can take that seat because I talk and I communicate all like you. I'm gonna be the same, but rather. I so appreciate this because truly, that's our students, that's our kids.And you're just about motherhood. Come on mama's. This is not mama's operation. It's okay for you too. It's okay for you too. It's a power move. It is a powerful move. Yeah. Noah, let's talk about your motherhood, because I think Cross Mamas was how we first connected, and I wanna talk about that because.It's such a gift. Yes. And there's such tension, right? Because the work is so hard and there's thousands of kids that you're serving in both in Houston and here, and I'm, and I wanna talk about that tension. But yes. Tension. Yeah. What kind of tension have you faced and how have you addressed it first?

Nella:: The first biggest tension that I faced was. Internal, trying to be a different version of myself at work than I was at home and actually worked backwards. I was more myself at work than I was at home. So I'll give you an example. Bless you. I'll give you an example. At work, I am a project manager.Like I am fast-paced. I am goal oriented. And I like to stay organized again, because for me, I need a lot of systems to help me internalize all the information, make sure that I'm staying on top of things, because I definitely always I will feel less like myself if I'm not prepared or if I don't have information or I'm not ready to deliver and because I can't.There's things I need. I need good systems and organizational structures for myself. Given the way that my brain works, I was then trying to be at home and trying to be fun and not have goals, and not have structures, and not have systems. Thinking that was more of what my kids needed from me.And the reality was that shift was. Really disruptive to the way that I was operating. It was exhausting. I was not actually less authentic at home than I was at work, and so I realized one day I was like, I gotta just. Everything about the way that I work and feel most like myself, I gotta be like that as a mother.And it's actually been a tremendous shift and one that is better. Like I have systems. We have a family meeting every Sunday that I lead. We set goals, we, and I have a tracker. I want to bring that element to my family life and I just feel so much better. So that was actually like tension number one.I think tension number two was setting the appropriate boundaries for my life with a really high demanding job. Again, the first part was really internal. So I'll never forget this moment when I was really ruminating about something at work. Like we all do. We're like, this conversation, maybe it didn't go well or this problem, or someone's perception of us we're just like spinning on it.And I always, one thing I always prioritized with my kids was their evening routine. Their bath, their book, their bed, and I remember reading to my daughter and I was somewhere completely different. And I was like, I have such little time with them, especially in the early days because my husband and I both had really demanding roles and we spent a lot of time in the car driving to daycare and from work, and Houston is a really big city.Our schools were all over the place. And I was like every moment that I have is precious and here I am like in this thing that's really important to me. And my mind is somewhere else. And I remember listening to the CEO of care.com many years ago and she was like, for working mothers so much.What we're projecting are actually our mind, like where we are mentally. And so if we can take control of our mental space we can actually influence so much more about the way we are showing up both at work and at home. 'cause we are one human being. And I realized, I was like, okay, I've gotta, I've gotta set better boundaries mentally. We always talk about leaving work at work. I think what we're talking about is where, whether we're opening our computer or not, I would actually offer, there's something more than what is on the computer. There's what's in our mind. And I've had to become extremely disciplined. About when and where I think about the problems that we're facing or the opportunities that we're facing, and also had to be disciplined about what I'm willing to give my mental energy to.Because when I'm with my children, my husband, like they deserve the best of me too. And I won't feel good about who I am as a person given what my identity is. If they're, if I'm giving my, everyone at work is getting the best of me, and then the people closest to me are not.

Analiza:: How true is that?We give our, the people we love most, our leftovers. And I'm a morning person, so gosh, that really shows up at the end of the day. I'm like, I got c. I'm also a morning person. Yeah. I remember I would curl up in, in my charter school days of leading schools, like really on the ground, I would be curled up on the sofa just I really can't move. It was so sad, right? I'm like, I'm here with you. I'm not able to play the game with you, but I'm here. And they're like, okay. That's sad. I think kids can tell yeah. One thing I don't like is that they're often like, if mommy's not in a good mood, like no one's in a good mood.

Nella:: And I'm just like, why does my mood have to? But it has. It is good feedback from them. Thank you for their feedback, kids. To help me better communicate. I need a little bit of rest right now. Or I need a little bit of time and. Let's figure out how I can show up better when they need a safe place.A safe place to land. Absolutely. And that's often at home, especially as they get older.

Analiza:: So Nella, let's talk about the boundary with your mind, because our minds are not yet done. Processing the day was a tough day and there's a lot of challenges, especially in a seat like yours. Yeah. I mean it's yeah. That is what the job is like. Crisis management, drama management, a lot of challenges. By the time it gets to you like it's hard. Yeah. How does one, 'cause it's not like they don't stop coming or that the problems are solved by 6:00 PM. How do you get the mind to say not now, because I'm with my little one.What is your strategy? Can you break it down for us? Because I wanna know what to do.

Nella:: Yeah. So one, another thing you learned about people with ADHD is you need transitional activities. Like from one task to another, or one thing to another. We think a lot about this with small children and their routines, like in an elementary school, like how do you move from the reading block to the math block?How do you move from bathroom break to recess? And, I have transitional activities like what the commute to work looks like, what the commute home looks like. How I process is really important. So I think those two times are really important. The second is I very much believe so deeply in things like the phone or friend strategy to talk through certain things.And so having a circle of. Close friends, confidants, colleagues are really critical for me. Having, identifying on my team, who my process partner is for different things is really important. I'm a very hands-on leader, very collaborative. So there are members of my team that I talk to. Literally almost every day, even if it's only for a quick 10 to 15 minutes.Because I wanna think through everything. I'm an external processor. I don't process as much in writing and having someone to talk to helps me even in a very quick amount of time, be ready to move on and move forward. So those two things help. If I notice that. My thinking is taking over and I try to notice it.I try to ask myself, okay, why? Is it because of an internal trigger that I'm having? Like I'm worried about something. If it's something that is really like a problem that we need to solve, then I'll make a decision, okay, who do I need to talk about this the next day? If it's more internal, oh, I don't feel like I handled that well, or I made a mistake, or then I will ask myself like, am I, is the thinking that I am doing helpful or harmful? And that alone takes care of the vast majority of it. It's actually harmful because you're judging yourself too harshly right now. And. You need to make this more helpful. How can I make this more helpful?I can decide when I wanna really think about this, or who do I want to talk to about this? And so I could put it on the list for talking with one of the many, like different coaches and supports that I have. And then the last one I will share is, culturally I like to stay very close to different aspects of my culture.And one of the ones that we actually talked about last year with some other Latino leaders is like the power of water in our lives. And I think. Connection to water is just really helpful and powerful, and it is a place where lots of ideas can come. So this was a lot easier when I lived in Texas because you have access to pools. Now it's a little bit colder, but I like to think about time to get a drink of water. Even the time you're washing your hands, like how I like cleansing myself from the day of all the worries all the. The concerns, like how can we wash those away and start anew? And I think we have those rituals available to us and we can use those even when we're in a demanding career.

Analiza:: No, that's beautiful. I hear a lot of embedded routines and systems that help. Yes, you can tell now in my time of what I do, or I'm feeling triggered, I can move to my, the three Bs like a book bed. There's a rhythm. And then you can say, oh, is this helping or hurting me? Let's drop the thinking.What's my next step? Okay, I've now planned it for the next day. All of those processes, the transition times are such beautiful ways that you don't have to whole hog say, oh, now I'm a different person. You can actually. Integrate them slowly but surely, and those daily practices are what help us be present, whether it's at work or it's at home.And the word is not balanced, but the word is, can I be present and really show up? And be fueled for the continuation. My downfall happens after I feel like 7:00 PM so I feel how you, I hear you continuing to sustain.

Nella:: Yeah. One thing and then being okay with learning things about yourself.Like our bodies and our minds have many gifts to tell us, but sometimes we reject them. We give more power to outside voices than we do to our own, and I think that has been something that has been such a powerful learning for me. And the more I listen to myself. The higher I'm able to perform versus, okay.I'll give you a good example. Folks that work late into the night owl my brain because of the way that it's designed at 9:00 PM it is done. I can, and early on different points in my career. I've known people that can work till midnight. That's actually when they do their best work.And even in college, like you would see, that was a badge of honor in my university. Like how late people were working doing homework till yes, we were very academic. I've had to be okay with the fact that at 9:00 PM like I shut off, my brain shuts off. There is no more work at that point.I need to get my work done at different times. I can wake up really early and have a stronger morning production than I can late at night, and I can't feel any kind of way about that. My brain has told me that's the way it works best, and so I need to listen to that. And I'm not gonna feel any guilt or any shame about leaving things until the next day, as long as I've managed, which is why I try to manage the deadlines and things like that in different ways.And so I think it's just like listening to ourselves is really important and being okay trusting our own inner voice.

Analiza:: I love to hear you say that because often we're taught to, what do I need to do for you? What do I need to do to talk and speak like you? But instead this is knowing like I have what I need.If I listen, I will get the answer. So this takes time. There's so much self-awareness, Nella, in all of your stories. I appreciate you so much. Thank you. Nella, are you ready for lightning round questions?

Nella:: I am.

Analiza:: Okay, first question. Chocolate or vanilla?

Nella::Chocolate

Analiza:: Eating or takeout?

Nella::I love a good home-cooked meal, but I am not a great cook, so I guess I would say takeout.

Analiza:: Nice. I'm a mountain or jump from a plane.

Nella:: Oh gosh, I am so terrified of heights, so I'm gonna say mountains 'cause I am in the mountains.

Analiza:: Have you ever worn socks with sandals?

Nella::No. No.

Analiza:: How would you rate your karaoke skills on a scale of one to 10? 10 being Mariah Carey.

Nella:: I'm gonna say a 5.5. I'm not a great singer, but I'm a great performer.

Analiza:: Nice. What's a book that you've loved or a recent book you've read?

Nella:: Okay I need to look it up because I did read this book recently and the title escapes me. It is by Ursula Burns. She was the CEO of Xerox. I read mostly memoirs and it's Where you are is not Who you are a memoir, Ursula Burns. She is a black woman, and was the CEO of Xerox. And it was a great memoir.

Analiza:: Talk about authentic leadership, right?

Nella:: Yes.

Analiza:: Let's talk about what is : your one favorite way to practice self-care?

Nella:: My one favorite way to practice self-care would be ensuring that I get enough sleep.

Analiza:: Let's talk about professional development. What's a good one that you've done?

Nella::I read every single day. But I would say it was a really transformational experience for me. I'm really going through a broad, I talk about it all the time. It was a really powerful and learning experience for me. The cohort model, the coaching, the exposure and shadowing of other CEOs and superintendents, it shaped a lot about the way that I think about my work even today.

Analiza:: Nice. : What's your definition of a boss mama?

Nella:: A boss Mama is a Mama who has come to learn and love the journey and is a champion for the belief that we are actually better as leaders when we embrace all of our identities, including motherhood.

Analiza:: Beautiful. What advice would you give your younger self?

Nella:: I've been asked this question before. You think I would be more ready for it? Your inner voice is, and your intuition is a powerful gift from so many sources yourself, your ancestors, your culture. And listen. Listen to it. Listen to it deeply, and trust it.

Analiza:: Nella, where can we find you? LinkedIn. Anywhere else?

Nella:: LinkedIn for sure. And I try to stay active there and talk a lot about my experiences leading DSST, the students and leaders, staff, teachers, families that I get to meet. And every now and then a little bit about myself too, which sometimes I struggle with.

Analiza:: Nice. And then. I'd love a final ask, a recommendation, or any parting thoughts to share.

Nella:: Yeah, so first off, just thank you, Gracias. This is a wonderful space that you've created and I feel a lot of gratitude for being welcomed into it. I want to encourage women of color leaders out there. We encounter a lot of challenges, some internal, some external but they're always there.And yet we are resourceful. We are creative, we are whole, and we have so much to offer the world. And what I always believe is like the first barrier cannot be ourself. And I hope that if I do anything in my work, it's bringing awareness to just how powerful we are in, in, in who we are and what we can bring in light and love and education and access to others.

Analiza:: So beautiful Nella.

Nella:: Thank you.

Analiza:: Wonderful to hear your story and hear how you're embracing. What a model for everyone to lean on those things that people are like, Ooh, poor you. You're like, actually, it's a strength and here's what I need you to do, right? Like it's a strength and here's what I need from you.They go together. So thank you for modeling that. Thank you for all the hard work on behalf of all the kids and families. I'm a mom too. I'm so grateful. So thank you, Nella. Thanks.

Nella:: It's not without a ton of challenge and learning. One thing I try to do is okay, I have two options of how I can look at something and I often lean towards the positive.It's not without a ton of learning, struggle, mistakes, failure, and yet we can, if hopefully my story illuminates, like we can come out on the other side of that. And find hope and growth and possibility in the midst of what might be hard. So thank you and just like excited to, to continue to listen to the stories of the women that you host.

Analiza:: Thank you so much for carving out time to hear today's podcast. 3 things before you go. First, if you found it helpful, please leave a five star review. Second, you can get a free chapter of my book, The Myth of Success: A Woman of Color's Guide to Leadership at analizawolf.com/freechapter. And lastly, if you're interested in executive coaching, please reach out to me at analiza@analizawolf.com. Thank you so very much